Comments on: OUT OF SIGHT, OUT OF MIND, OUT OF LUCK

By: Cecil Hill

Cecil Hill — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 10:41:17 +0000

I think you would have been much more accurate if you had stated “the Red Army has treated the Tibetans (and other minorities) like shit from 1959 to (research the date when they realized their mistake) xxxx and those who remember resent these Han no accounts.

I say specific inclusive dates because I have met several older people who were treated like shit but then recently things have changed. One guy in Kunming (Pete) approached me and quoted perfectly the Gettysburg Address and then the Preamble to the Constitution of the US. He was 83 years old and had been forced to work in the coal minds near Kunming for over 40 years. The reason - too much English from his friends the Flying Tigers.

The government had recently taken him to Beijing and apologized for the past action and rewarded him with a nice pension and health care. Talk about a man full of history!

This seems to be the current government policy - acknowledging past “sins” and working to help the minorities. Hey, it is good business as well because millions of Chinese travel around China in search of minority culture. Look at LiJiang and Shangri-La if you doubt what I am writing. Billions poured into these “disney-like” creations for the local minorities (Naxi in Lijiang and Tibetans in Shangri-La). I see it happening everywhere I travel. The latest was to XiJiang Miao village in Guizhou Province. The government is not stupid now (meaning they were back then!).

By: Surabaya Stew

Surabaya Stew — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 05:00:05 +0000

Thank you for replying to my comment, Cecil Hill. It’s good to hear that some students in China are getting what is obviously a very fine education from you. It is obvious that you care very much about all of them, and we should all respect that. Truthfully, I have not been to China, with the exceptions of Hong Kong and Macau, so I do not question that you have a better sense of what the average Chinese thinks than the MSN does.

Actually, I do have an inkling of what the average Chinese-American thinks about Tibet, and it’s not too different from the average mainland opinion! “Fuck em’ all, those ungrateful bastards!” seems to sum it up, I’m afraid. Just like the Tibet-heads can’t get around the fact that Tibet belongs to China and any hope for independence are foolish beyond belief, the average Chinese anywhere in the world can’t seem to grasp that the Red Army has treated the Tibetans like shit since 1959 and they resent the Han settlers very much. Moderation seems to be lacking in all quarters…

Of course, I am betting on the fact that the members of ethnic minorities in China who come to your school might not be representative of the average non-Han Chinese citizen. A trip to the Tibetan-majority areas (not just Tibet proper), sounds like an excellent opportunity to get closer to the truth. As I can see from your blog, you are already having quite an excellent time getting around China right now. I look forward to reading more about your travels!

By: Thomas Jackson

Thomas Jackson — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:29:24 +0000

Some people believe that the PRC is friendly toward the USA. These same people argued that the former USSR wasn’t a threat to the USA.

Some people never learn.

By: still liberal

still liberal — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 01:03:44 +0000

Typical G. W. Bush. Doesn’t understand the situation, offers a boneheaded solution and ignores those who might have a different, more useful opinion. But he is still light years ahead of the IOC, the most corrupt “governing” body of sports on the planet. This multi-billion dollar con game needs to be eliminated. The Olympics are the dirty end of the patriotic stick. Ginning up national pride then levying massive entry fees for host countries and participant nations with a majority of sporting events that most people would not walk across the street to see for free if not wrapped in national and Olympic flags. A pox on their house.

By: Clint

Clint — Tue, 08 Jul 2008 00:38:10 +0000

“We are, after all, talking about a small gesture that if the Chinese do indeed get their nose all bent out of shape because of it, only prove themselves to be unworthy of any approbation for having “come so far” as a nation.”

Wow. That just sounds weird (or dare I say it, liberal?).

What does it matter whether the Chinese are “worthy” of our respect — the better question is: What can we gain by insulting them?

My guess: We gained something more by not insulting them. We gained North Korea’s big step forward in the nuclear negotiations.

By: Cecil Hill

Cecil Hill — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 22:29:44 +0000

Kevin is, in fact, a student from Tibet who is a personal friend and I have played basketball with many Tibetan students. We also have many other minority students whom I have gotten to know and love.

What would you believe, Surabaya Stew, and what would you not believe if I told you what their opinions were? If their beliefs matched yours, then obviously I am not lying. If their beliefs did not match yours, then obviously I am lying. Once more, reading the MSM gives absolutely no clue about the attitudes of Chinese in China.

What is the truth in Tibet? I have yet to visit there but plan to in the near future. Many times our preconceptions prevent us from seeing truth as it really is. Truth, I seek but truth is often covered by many layers of my own personal biases.

BTW, the Tibetan students would disagree with Rick in his most negative statements but would probably agree that theirs is not the most viable economic group in China.

By: Surabaya Stew

Surabaya Stew — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 16:57:06 +0000

An interesting point is that no sitting US president has attended the opening ceremonies when it has been held outside the USA. Remember how Dubya send his dad into Athens 4 years ago? Obviously, there is no real reason for our President to go, Tibet crisis or not. The fact that he is attending suggests a political ploy rather than China deserving his presence on August 8th. However, if we can get something out of the Chinese government for this, then I am all for it. As much as I am unhappy with our President, this is not something to get worked up over.

Thank you Cecil Hill for your observations; it is quite true that there is much more to the story than “China wrong, Tibet right”. Actually, I am quite willing to support the Chinese government over their sovereignty, except that they are being total assholes when it comes to the Tibetan people. One could take your point about asking your Chinese students, and inquiring if you have any Tibetan students who could be asked about Rick’s comments. (Somehow, I think they would agree with him.) These people are not grateful for the Chinese presence, even if destroying the feudal system was in their interests. The communist party is intent on ignoring that fact, in which case the world can expect the mess to continue. Tibet can never be free in any sense of the word, until China is free. Judging by the events of this past March and April, that day is not coming soon.

By: Chris

Chris — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 16:42:23 +0000

Since the Chinese have been in possession of Tibet for some sixty years, and no one is inclined to do anything more than harrumph about it, I hardly think that any symbolic protests about it are going to do anything at all. I really don’t know what you expect from the President, unless you think that insulting the Chinese for no discernible gain is preferable to not embarrassing them when we could use their cooperation in a region, where, as you say, they are actively throwing around their weight.

As Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton showed us, appeals to emotion get us nothing in terms of respect or cooperation. These other leaders aren’t looked to for actual, you know, leadership, of anything but their own backyards. They can afford to engage in silly posturing. We can’t.

By: Increase Mather

Increase Mather — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 12:17:24 +0000

Do you ever wonder if large portions of our “press” is actually corrupt?

I mean, do they take money and favors to choose “news”?

Twenty years ago I never would have believed such a thing……now, I just don’t know.

By: Cecil Hill

Cecil Hill — Mon, 07 Jul 2008 01:25:57 +0000

I have lived and worked in China teaching at the university level for the past year and a half. I speak Chinese (trained by the USAF many years ago) and have been married to an ethnic Chinese (American citizen) for over thirty years. Having stated by credentials, what are yours? When do you believe the MSM and when do you not believe it? There are two sides to every issue. Suggest you try to find the Chinese side to balance your opinion in what you write.

Do not forget that there was legal slavery in Tibet in the 1950s and the feudal system was very much real and alive there prior to the Chinese “liberation.” I use the term “liberation” here on purpose because that is exactly what happened.

I am no liberal but I am honest and realistic. I am no spokesperson for the Chinese government but I do have Chinese students who would find your comments to be both insulting and wrong. BTW, these are real students who are in pursuit of the same truth that every college student is pursuing.

I read your blog daily so do not dismiss me as an apologist for China. Every country makes mistakes and the Tibet situation was huge, playing into the situation that those who fomented it wanted. No excuse for this evil stupidity but Tibet - suggest you do more research on the actual situation there and not believe people like Richard Guere and others who hug themselves and say - oh, how awful it is to be able to NOT BE A SLAVE under the ruling monks.