Comments on: OBAMA’S CAIRO SPEECH COULD HAVE BEEN BRAVER

By: lionheart

lionheart — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 18:27:36 +0000

ignatov,
Tu quo que is famous for being a fallacious logical argument. Which is why I prefaced the passage you quoted with a disclaimer that I was using it not for argument or justification, but to point out the irony of being accused of something that the accuser is doing himself.

Michael Reynolds,
Fair enough. Hands shaken, and virtual drinks consumed (I like single malt scotch too).

By: ignatov

ignatov — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 16:34:11 +0000

“you accuse Obama critics of the exact same thing you did (and still do) to Bush”

It’s the old “everyone else is doing it” defense.

Thanks for the even-handed analysis, Rick.

By: michael reynolds

michael reynolds — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 14:06:19 +0000

Lionheart:

That would be some brilliant math. Except that I get paid by my publisher to write the book. Your purchase of same repays them incrementally for what they’ve paid me. (Until we get to a certain point.)

But I’m glad you liked the book.

And I have a suggestion: why don’t we both stop being bitches, shake hands and have a virtual drink?

By: lionheart

lionheart — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 11:04:20 +0000

Michael Reynolds,

I’m sorry to beat a dead horse, but I wanted you to know that I discovered with a little research, that I have actually read one of your books (Gone). However, it cost me only $4.98, for 576 pages. That’s a bit less than a penny a page, so I think you are inflating your rate by a few million percent (just joking- your book was excellent, and I would recommend it to anyone).

And I didn’t use it for T.P.

By: lionheart

lionheart — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 10:45:29 +0000

Joe, tu quo que.

I’m not using the tu quo que argument to justify irrational criticism of Obama, I am just pointing out how richly ironic it is that you accuse Obama critics of the exact same thing you did (and still do) to Bush. For evidence, I note your 4th sentence.

By: brooks

brooks — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 05:39:19 +0000

thanks for the even-handed take, ed.!

By: Scott

Scott — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 03:41:16 +0000

Joe, interesting analysis. As I read your post I realized how I could easily switch the names and party affiliation with Democrats and liberals and much of what you said would be equally true of the unhinged liberal left. You are in power for now. But nothing lasts forever in politics. You all were equally unfair and rabid for the past 8 years specifically and for the last 50 years in general. Its a sad commentary on American politics that so many on both sides are so demeaning towards those who they don’t agree with and show an intolerable lack of ability to interact on a civilized and intelligent level (and yes, I did say both sides).

Having said that, this was a fine speach that people on both sides can find things to agree with and to disagree with. I appreciate sane voices on both sides that discuss the issue. Have you thought of joining them in civil discourse?

By: Joe

Joe — Fri, 05 Jun 2009 01:27:38 +0000

The neocons hate Obama Michael, you can’t have a rational discussion with them. They attack Obama whenever he does, or says, anything. Rick, to his credit doesn’t. I’m sure the invasion of Iraq by Bush and his cowboy rhetoric set relations back with moderate Muslims about 100 years.The neocons ignore this fact,Obama has to repair relations with the Muslim world.The neocons would rather bomb them into submission, they have no time for diplomacy. And they love the cutesy phrases like “dear leader” and messiah and “the one”. Basically they wish they had a charismatic and intelligent leader like Obama. Instead they have retreads like Newt, and Rove, and Dick Moriss.The only thing that neocons fear is losing power, they are angry because they have been crushed in the last 2 elections. As their numbers shrink, they grow more shrill, which only pushes away the moderates and independents that are needed to win elections. A death spiral. good riddance.

By: Obama’s Speech in Cairo: 6,000 Words and What Some are Already Saying - Updated w/ Even More Stuff Other People Are Saying | All American Blogger

Fri, 05 Jun 2009 00:17:51 +0000

[...] Right Wing Nut House I saw the speech this morning and just finished reading the transcript. My initial impression from watching it was, I believe, correct; it was a very good speech with some eye popping assumptions that were just plain false, a glossing over of some points that needed to be hit harder, and a troubling lack of candor about the Muslim world regarding extremism that he either believes or deliberately failed to address. [...]

By: Neo

Neo — Thu, 04 Jun 2009 23:35:00 +0000

Bottom line … he mailed this one in